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Talk: Updates/10.80

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Checklist[]

Checklist for when the update goes live.

  • Yes CheckFix Template:Next Update & Next Update
  • Yes CheckFix Template:Last Update & Last Update
  • Replace contents of Loot Statistics/Code with that of Loot Statistics/Code/10.8.
  • Remove all statements that say "Will be introduced ..." and similar (not sure why we still do this, since templates add {{Futureupdate}} now automatically.)
  • Update Template:Price to Sell, Template:Price to Buy
  • Add references to the appropriate achievements on each mounts' pages.
  • Confirm and add trade information for the NPCs
  • Update item sell-to / buy-from lists (reference the above list).
  • Yes CheckObtain a fresh list of world transfer restrictions
  • Add Sharon's adjusted transcripts for world transfer.
  • Yes CheckConfirm points of achievements.
  • Update creature locations.
  • Update item pages for loot and quest rewards.
  • Update Mini World Changes.

-- Sixorish (talk) 09:54, July 11, 2015 (UTC)

Cool. Also, I think it would be better to mention mount achievements on their pages through the use of a parameter which would only be added when a mount is categorised as a free one. Spoilers could then be used to add the same information to the 'pre-mount' creatures. -- Wouterboy (talk) 17:11, July 11, 2015 (UTC)

Oddity[]

Uhmm... does anyone know why the Thick-Skinned achievement is displayed as 'Think-Skinned'? It's spelled correctly, and it even shows the right information... --Wouterboy (talk) 15:09, June 24, 2015 (UTC)

Should work fine now. Great job adding all of the achievements.

Cauli92 (talk) 15:14, June 24, 2015 (UTC)

Ugh, I'm a dumbass. Thanks for fixing that. Oh, and also: one secret achievement still needs to be discovered! -- Wouterboy (talk) 15:18, June 24, 2015 (UTC)

Runes[]

moved from Talk:Avalanche Rune (Strong)

I'd rather call such items 'Self-Made' instead of 'Strong'. -- Wouterboy (talk) 14:41, June 24, 2015 (UTC)

All right, it's up to discussion. I decided to just make one and was about to make a Talk page about it myself. Personally I don't like self-made as they can be made by anyone, so Cipsoft's feature name is a bit misleading.

Cipsoft has replaced old runes with new ones, so new ones have old IDs and 'old' runes are technically completely new, so I'd propose doing it like that:
Copy old template of one rune, keep both pages: XXXX Rune
and
XXXX Rune (Strong)

First one(Weakened):

  • Add <noinclude> ''This article is about XXXX Runes bought from shop or looted. For the player-made variation check [[XXXX Rune (Strong)]]'' </noinclude>
  • Leave implemented as it is?
  • Change SpriteID
  • Done


Second one(Strong):

  • Add <noinclude> ''This article is about Avalanche Rune made by players. For the spell to create them, see [[Avalanche]]. For the variation bought in shops, check [[Avalanche Rune]].'' </noinclude>
  • Add (Strong) at the and of a name, add | actualname
  • Add 12 Sprites ID with 100ms delays(Or can a bot do that?)
  • Change implemented to 10.8
  • Delete NPC price and Buyfrom

Does it fly with everyone? Do you have any suggestions?

Thanks in advance,
Cauli92 (talk) 14:52, June 24, 2015 (UTC)

I will start making and uploading new rune/ammo gifs soon, so I'd be thankful if someone else could vote whether we name them (Strong), (Self-Made) or maybe even (Player-Made).

Cauli92 (talk) 08:48, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Can you list again the difference between the "normal" runes and the "sparkling" runes?

  • bought in shops
  • looted from creatures
  • made by players
  • obtained in quests
  • other.. ?

Cauli, have you seen Updates/10.8/Sprite Changes? I found some weird removal of sprites, could you double check on TS if it's really removed? -- Bennie (talk ~ fellows) 08:55, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

I think you got all the differences right, made by players are the only 'sparkling' and rest are 'normal'

Unfortunatelly I'm not really able to do the investigation on Testserver, as it seems like support for Windows XP ends with new client version, so I'm not able to run it at all(missing updated C++ version which isn't compatibile with XP). And I refuse to work on our beloved Flash Client as it gives me terrible experience.

But I've checked current and TS Dat files and if you're talking ramps, doors etc, I believe Cipsoft have just merged repetitions as in past they would add the same images under different IDS when they made new territories, perhaps in order to have all necessary sprites next to each other. E.g.

  • 18660 is a repetition of 604.
  • 16872 was a repetition of 1624.

About 19221, I don't recall what it is, but it's surly not Magical Cage Key which id is 9113.

Cauli92 (talk) 09:44, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

My opinon:

  • We shouldn't change ID and implemented parameters of existing pages;
  • Old pages should have their name and actualname parameters changed;
  • Old pages should have their npcprice and buyfrom parameters removed;
  • Old pages should link to new pages and vice-versa (either a note at the top of the page or {{seealso}} in the notes parameter can be used);
  • Old pages should be renamed (keeping redirect) accoring to their name parameter;
  • New pages should be created for new runes, they should have all relevant parameters (including this update's client version as their implemented version);
  • Trade lists of NPCs who sell runes should be changed as well as Template:Price to Buy;
  • History pages should be created mentioning the changes brought by this update. (This is not high priority, we could wait till we have defined a well-accepted template for history pages.)

The same for new & old ammo, plus...

  • Creatures should be removed from droppedby parameter on old ammunition pages;
  • Creatures that drops ammunition should have their loot changed;
  • Loot analyzer should be changed in order to recognize ammunition dropped by creatures as new ammunition.

Concerning spriteid parameter, let SixBot add it automatically later.

Hunter of Dragoes (Talk · Contribs · Admins) - 12:52, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

'Player-Made' is more truthful than 'Self-Made', I'm with you on that and I think it's the best option. Regarding pictures, I have already uploaded the six that were visible in the teaser (and put them on the update page), so you won't have to do those. -- Wouterboy (talk) 12:59, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

All right, great, then that's the name I will use tomorrow for these sprites. I've checked the already-uploaded pics, I can surly just rename the runes, but I'd like to have all amount sprites when it comes to ammunition, and therefore I would rather remake them, like this one: Arrow (Self-Made).

Cauli92 (talk) 22:12, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

I would prefer to see "(Weak)" for the store-bought ones. The IDs of existing runes aren't changing, so I don't think our pages should change either. The strong ones aren't "new" as you said. If the items weren't so tied together anyone would think they were removing old runes from stores and creating new ones for the NPCs to sell, and in that case we would treat them separately so we should do the same now: treat old runes as new strong runes and create weak versions of them. -- Sixorish (talk) 09:00, June 26, 2015 (UTC)

Well, that makes even more sense. I'm with Six. -- Wouterboy (talk) 09:34, June 26, 2015 (UTC)

All right, sounds reasonable, that's how I will make them in this case. Just a quick heads up as I'm about to leave - sorry for re-scheduling this, but I wasn't able to make them or anything else today as I was out whole day taking care of work errands and I had no idea they will last the full day. I will take care of it during the weekend, I promise!

Cauli92 (talk) 17:20, June 26, 2015 (UTC)

In that case there's going to be a lot of follow-up work with NPC Sell lists, some loots and quests(?), we will have to add " (Weak)" on each page link and corresponding gif. Do you think it can be done by bot once I'm done with the pages?

Cauli92 (talk) 14:15, June 27, 2015 (UTC)

SixBot will do what I tell him to do. But to avoid mistakes, what is he editing exactly? There are about 1000 text references to those items (not including things like "GFB"). I guess I can safely limit SixBot's edit's to NPCs? Will Hand of Cursed Fate be an issue? What about arrows that are often dropped by creatures, I don't even know what kind of arrows are dropped. -- Sixorish (talk) 15:35, June 27, 2015 (UTC)

Oh, and since the old runes are related to the new runes, I suggest adding a note to each page, not just the message at the top. Something like "| notes = This is a strong, player-made Avalanche Rune." -- Sixorish (talk) 15:44, June 27, 2015 (UTC)

Well, the more I think of it, the more I go back to the idea of making (Strong) or (Player-Made) rune pages instead, while it may not exactly be correct because of what you said few "posts" back, it would save us whole lot of problems...

Right now we will also need exceptions for these items in Loot Statistics code and on each of monster pages. I guess that can be done manually if we want to avoid SixBot mistakes as it's not so many pages anyway.

You can see what drops what arrows/bolts on listed pages.

Cauli92 (talk) 15:49, June 27, 2015 (UTC)

No matter which process we use, there will be complications. It's not hard to make exceptions in the Loot Statistics code. It's not hard to do any of this, it just takes a bit of time and consideration. SixBot won't make errors, I will make errors in my judgement of what needs to be changed. When we have the "Weak" runes set up I'll go ahead and start converting everything over. Leave the old runes (buyfrom, npcprice) as is until at least the update passes, that way our users have minimal disruptions. -- Sixorish (talk) 16:15, June 27, 2015 (UTC)

Actually I think I could do the whole process automatically, even creating new rune articles. I just need the edits to be checked. -- Sixorish (talk) 16:22, June 27, 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for the help, Six! I decided to move the message to the beginning of the notes, added (Weak) to some of the links and removed the spell link as they cannot be made this way anymore. It's not the best job as I could've added more notes on my own, but as I tried to at least remove/modify all irrevelant information, I think it will suffice for now. I will make the check later in case I have filled in any invalid information, but more proper improvement of the pages can wait until we decide to revamp all runes one day, as the info is quite outdated on most of the articles.

Cauli92 (talk) 09:29, June 28, 2015 (UTC)

Oh, I have also decided to move UH and IH from Ultimate Healing Rune (Item) (Weak) to Ultimate Healing Rune (Weak) for better display. Is it okey or should I change it back?

Cauli92 (talk) 09:29, June 28, 2015 (UTC)

I think it's best to call it 'Ultimate Healing Rune (Item Weak)'. -- Wouterboy (talk) 10:09, June 28, 2015 (UTC)

Version number[]

The version number is 10.80, not 10.8. We should update all old references that point to 10.8.

— Mathias (profile, talk) 07:06, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Don't do such big updates on your own, especially if you use VisualEditor, whole page was ruined by it and no image was displayed, also admins can rename old pages and keep logs instead of adding brand new pages, so next time please just mention it on the Talk page and wait for some experienced Admin to verify the whole thing.

Cauli92 (talk) 07:20, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Possibly someone would be able to make some sort of exception that would read 10.8 as 10.80 and therefore, we might be able to avoid editing so many pages separately.

Cauli92 (talk) 07:24, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Although you are technically correct Mathias, we always used numbers without zeros added in the past. Changing this is possible, but requires quite some editing and possible bugs when this is forgotten at some pages. So let's keep it 10.8 for now, is that ok with you? -- Bennie (talk ~ fellows) 07:27, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, was just about to comment that. We have always done it without zeroes at the end, and created categories based on it etc. -- Wouterboy (talk) 07:30, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Cauli, FWIW, I didn’t use VisualEditor. Source view ftw!

Possibly someone would be able to make some sort of exception that would read 10.8 as 10.80 and therefore, we might be able to avoid editing so many pages separately.

That would be excellent!

Bennie, I would strongly prefer to use the correct version, 10.80, i.e. major version 1 and minor version 80. Minor version 8 (i.e. “10.8”) would have been released years ago if it had existed. Just because we’ve been doing it wrong historically doesn’t mean we have to keep repeating that mistake. IMHO it’s better to change it now for this particular page, now that most update-related pages and references/links still need to be created. We can leave the old ones as-is.

— Mathias (profile, talk) 07:37, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

If we're gonna do it for this update, we should be consistent and do it for all. As for all pages that then need editing, I think Six can easily make his bot add a zero to the end of every big update implementation, thus categorising them correctly. -- Wouterboy (talk) 07:42, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

I know what you mean, Mathias, but luckily for TibiaWiki, you're wrong - the "10.8" you are thinking about, the one implemented year or years ago would be called Updates/10.08, same as Updates/10.01 was called, which is totally different update than Updates/10.1.

If we were to change all versions, we would also have to find out when did Cipsoft change their policy about that, because in past versions were just called Updates/7.6(I checked Info in old client), even tho previous version was Updates/7.55. For that reason, I'd say it's better to keep it as it is.

Cauli92 (talk) 07:57, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Cauli, it has been like this at least since version 9.60 (confirmed in old client).

— Mathias (profile, talk) 08:55, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

All right, thanks for the information, but since 7.6/7.55 case is definite confirmation that first number after dot always stands for decimal number, I would still vote for keeping it as it is.

Cauli92 (talk) 09:43, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

If you guys can wait, in a few weeks I can check every client version since 7.0 to determine if it is #.#0 or just #.#.

Hunter of Dragoes (Talk · Contribs · Admins) - 12:24, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Hunter, please do! Ideally we should use the exact same version numbers that CipSoft uses for each version.

— Mathias (profile, talk) 14:48, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

New NPCs[]

If anyone meets them in game, please provide screenshots as well, that will help me a lot in making the gif. Thanks in advance.

Cauli92 (talk) 09:44, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Cauli, wouldn’t it be easier to extract the sprites from `Tibia.spr`? I can give it a try. Will let you know.

— Mathias (profile, talk) 11:17, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

I think Cauli's idea was to use the Outfiter and base the outfit, gender, addons and colors on a screenshot somebody made. I don't think Tibia.spr has this information (which npc has which outfit?). -- Bennie (talk ~ fellows) 11:24, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Bennie, you’re right, Tibia.spr doesn’t seem to contain separate sprites for each NPC (which, come to think of it, makes a whole lot of sense).

— Mathias (profile, talk) 17:40, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Mapping 10.8[]

Personal checklist for Mapper mapping.

Ankrahmun
Cormaya
Edron
Port Hope
Tiquanda
Kha'zeel Mountains
  • Yes Check(Only 2?) Kha'zeel Mountains Dragon Lairs, located here
Venore
  • Yes CheckTainted Souls
Darashia
Darama
Orc Land


Liberty Bay

-- Sixorish (talk) 05:35, June 26, 2015 (UTC)

New Achievements[]

Hi,

I have added the achievement "Lost Palace Raider". As is spoiled by cipsoft here: http://forum.test.tibia.com/forum/?action=thread&threadid=180&pagenumber=12

But when I try to update the list with new achievements here. Something goes wrong and the form fills in alot of unknown achievements. Probably it is my computer (it happend before). But maybe I missed something. Tustanuxo (talk) 08:48, July 8, 2015 (UTC)

Thanks Tustanuxo! Do you see it in the list yet? I purged the cache. -- Bennie (talk ~ fellows) 09:00, July 8, 2015 (UTC)

Thanks. It works :) I believe this were all the achievements this summer update then. Tustanuxo (talk) 09:34, July 8, 2015 (UTC)

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